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From: John (
Subject:         Re: Im sorry.
Date: August 20, 2014 at 12:02 am PST

In Reply to: Im sorry. posted by Durianrider on August 19, 2014 at 4:47 pm:

I was booted off in 2011, here is my reason. Read from the bottom up.



May 16, 2011



May 17, 2011



May 18, 2011



May 19, 2011



May 19, 2011


To Me

May 22, 2011

You've lost me. We do things our way and if it doesn't work for you then we can't help you.
No offence intended but there are other forums that may be more inviting of your views.

On 20/05/2011, at 5:12 AM, John Viitanen wrote:

Hi Freelee,

Honesty is the best policy. If I lose mine honour, I lose myself. --Shakespeare

Here I go again, so because I believe what I have come to know in the evolution of us my suspension is still valid because dissension in the ranks is unacceptable on 30bad? I'm court martialled for my insubordination. I just read an interesting article about orangutans fishing in a science news magazine just before I went online at the library, found the email you sent asking me the question about why I am suspended. As I wrote you the first time, I tried to explain myself but my heart felt words weren't so well received. So I go online to this abbreviated version of the same article NOW:

Orangutans Use Simple Tools to Catch Fish

By Bruce Bower, Science News Email Author
April 18, 2011 |
12:00 pm |
Categories: Animals

MINNEAPOLIS ¡ª Orangutans swim about as well as they fly, but research on three Indonesian islands shows that these long-limbed apes nonetheless catch and eat fish..

Orangutans living in Borneo scavenge fish that wash up along the shore and scoop catfish out of small ponds for fresh meals, anthropologist Anne Russon of York University in Toronto reported on April 14 at a meeting of the American Association of Physical Anthropologists. Over two years, Russon saw several animals on these forested islands learn on their own to jab at catfish with sticks, so that the panicked prey would flop out of ponds and into a red ape¡¯s waiting hands.

¡°If orangutans can do this, then early hominids could also have practiced tool-assisted fishing,¡± Russon said.

Although orangutans usually fished alone, Russon observed pairs of apes catching catfish on a few occasions. In one case, an orangutan cringed and pulled away as its companion extracted a fish from a pond. Russon suspects that the onlooker was learning ¡ª or at least trying to learn ¡ª how to nab aquatic snacks.

Observations of fishing by orangutans raise the likelihood that hominids ate meat, including fish, before the emergence of the Homo genus around 2.5 million years ago (SN: 9/11/10, p. 8), said anthropologist David Braun of the University of Cape Town in South Africa. Anthropologists have traditionally held that meat-eating first assumed prominence among early Homo species and fueled brain expansion.

Fish, even more than red meat, contains fatty acids essential for human brain growth. Good archaeological evidence of fish eating goes back no further than about 2 million years ago in members of theHomo genus, which includes modern humans.

Russon and her colleagues monitored daily behavior among orangutans in Borneo from 2004 to 2006. In 2007, the researchers stocked a small pond with catfish and videotaped orangutan visits to the pond over the course of one day.

Seventeen times orangutans scavenged for fish or grabbed fish out of ponds ¡ª several times from the prestocked pond ¡ª and immediately ate their prey. Apes used sticks to jab at catfish in the prestocked pond and in other ponds, as well.

Fishing isn¡¯t common among primates, but it does occur. Chimpanzees occasionally pluck fish out of ponds, Russon said. Some monkeys that swim well, including certain macaque and baboon species, also catch fish with their hands.

What¡¯s impressive is that orangutans spend most of their time in the trees and have no aptitude for swimming, Russon said. ¡°They sink like stones in the water.¡±

Orangutans¡¯ determined fishing efforts underscore the nutritional importance of marine foods for apes in general, not just people, Russon said. Individual orangutans in Borneo may have discovered by accident that they could grab fish along the shore and in ponds. These animals then adapted sticks to the task of catching elusive pond catfish.

Ancient hominids probably did much the same, Russon said, moving from opportunistic fish gathering to deliberate fishing.

Image: 1) An orangutan plays in water at a zoo. (harrymoon/Flickr) 2) An orangutan in Borneo plucks a catfish from a pond. A researcher who observed the apes catching and eating fish says that the earliest members of the human evolutionary family may have done the same. (Indrayana)

How ironic we just think about natural selection and a biased opinion has to pervert the truth. Has Jeremy spoken? It's in the water. Anyway we are one with the science of evolutionary theory. And there is much to learn. But you cannot sway my opinion based on 811 theory about EFAs when I heard what Udo Erasmus, the so-called Fat Man lectured from his vast research on the subject.

Though I am not naturally honest, I am so sometimes by chance. William Shakespeare


that is to say:Understanding Prevails Through All Things

From: Freelee
To: John Viitanen
Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2011 10:07:35 PM
Subject: Re: Suspension

Fruits and greens provide all the omega 3's and 6's you need AND in the correct balance, hemp seeds are not needed nor do we recommend them for that matter.

From Dr Rick Dina:

"So where do we get our Omega 3 fats from? First of all, they are in virtually all fruits and vegetables. Although it has been quite difficult to get an exact figure, it is fair to say that 1000 calories of ¡°regular¡± fruits and vegetables contain approximately 1 gram of Alpha-Linolenic Acid, the Omega 3 Essential Fatty Acid (EFA). So if you consume 2000 calories and all of those calories come from fruits and vegetables, you have met your Omega 3 EFA requirements. Many athletes, of course, may consume considerably more calories than 2000 per day. There are very few people that consume such large quantities of fresh fruits and vegetables, and that is why they are not usually considered a major source of EFAs. Fruits and vegetables also contain Omega 6 fats, in the form of Linoleic Acid (LA) in about a 1:1 ratio with the omega 3 fats."

On 18/05/2011, at 5:00 AM, John Viitanen wrote:

Hi Freelee,
Of course I know why. And not just some idea either. I said I had seen it all then the ramble that comes out is innocent on my behalf. But the words are all too damning to those who hear them out of context. You can take me anyway you like, I'm not out to change the world here. I have an interesting take on life and if those peace keepers wield their power at anything that tweaks them in the slightest on any given day, then suspension time for those questioning the authority on the site. All happens as it is supposed to anyway, so I don't question why. "To be or not to be, that is the question..." Hamlet posed. But I say, 'Know, to "eh" is not to question, but to error out.' Must be a Canadian thing. You can decide whether or not my last post in a discussion about food is contrary to the rules. I do only eat raw fruit and hemp seed as the only exception to the rule of fruit for life, but this is because I strongly believe Omega 3 and Omega 6 are overlooked by Dr. Graham as crucial to our physiology. And where I go with this to come back to this point of contention nobody knows, because somebody had to be the Radical to the big Whigs if we are going to be liberal in our discussions.


that is to say:Understanding Prevails Through All Things

From: Freelee
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2011 8:10:46 PM
Subject: Suspension

Hi there, why did you get suspended? I know you must have some idea so I would like to hear, thanks

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