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From: Tom ZeCat (
Subject:         I don't need lectures from you
Date: September 14, 2007 at 6:13 am PST

In Reply to: read a book posted by Bart on September 13, 2007 at 8:22 pm:

I know all about the Shah's cancer treatment because I followed the story as it happened in '79 and have read about it after the fact. It was the Shah's treatment of the Iranian people that had them so enraged. The cancer treatment merely triggered that built-up rage. By itself it never would have been enough to cause the overthrow of the embassy.

All the facts I wrote about are true. You can't point to a single thing that was inaccurate. And my opinions are well supported. You even agreed with my opinion that the hostage taking was wrong, so you really don't have much to b1tch about. And I already said that the support of the Shah was both wrong and a huge political mistake, and then you point me to some book that only proves what I already said.

What is ridiculous is your claim that Iran would not be our enemy if we just decided we harbored them no ill will. That one's way out there. Any reasonable person knowledgeable about our mideast relations knows that there's been WAY too much damage done to expect some kind of easy reconcilliation if we simply come out and say, "We've decided not to be your enemy." That's got to be one of the most naive points of view I've seen. Much of the damage to the US/Iranian relationship is our fault -- as I already said in the first post. Where I differ from the far left "blame America solely" crowd is I expect the Iranians to take responsibility for what they've done to damage it. You admit that they were wrong to take the hostages. Maybe you can prove yourself a little less naive than I thought if you'll also admit that they're jointly to blame for our bad relations.

And I've got to say to you something similar to what I say to far right nuts. I often find myself saying, "Every issue isn't ab0rtion." To you I say, "Every issue isn't Israel." Israel didn't make us support the Shah, nor did they make the Iranians overthrow the embassy. Those two actions are the responsibility of the US and Iran respectively.

And, btw, If Bush uses any of this to invade Iran, I'll stand shoulder to shoulder with you in protest. None of this warrants attacking that country and we don't have the forces necessary to do so anyway. (Yes, I know, those facts won't necessarily stop Bush.)

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